Do Not Marry Before Age 30

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Re: Do Not Marry Before Age 30

Postby Big Vern » Sun Jun 16, 2013 19:54

I'd passed 40 when my better half decided she wanted to get up the duff. It was hard work, but someone had to do it :smile:
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Re: Do Not Marry Before Age 30

Postby Icon » Sun Jun 16, 2013 23:51

I am more than willing to share my nature's blessing long-life genes with any Taiwanese available. Alas, they are scurry fellows, not easy to catch. Too much competition. I promised myself I would go back with an Asian baby and I ain't going home empty-handed!!!

So I said in my thirties...

Unfortunately, 30 came and went a long time ago... so my good genes and I won't be doing any sharing, sniff sniff.
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Re: Do Not Marry Before Age 30

Postby Toad » Sun Jun 16, 2013 23:53

Don't worry. According to the chart HH2 posted back there, your fertility doesn't hit rock-bottom until about age 42. There's time to snare your unsuspecting (hairy?) Taiwanese beau yet.

EDIT: 42? Damn. Douglas Adams was right again.
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Re: Do Not Marry Before Age 30

Postby HeadhonchoII » Mon Jun 17, 2013 00:09

Well there are tricks that people do such as saving eggs and IVF but they are not guarantees of anything.
I'm not writing this to annoy people I just think a lot of people are not aware of these statistics.
If somebody wants a baby just go and do it I say..man or no man.

I got the career of my dreams, I got the man of my dreams, and I got the children of my dreams. I got married at age 38, which by governmental standards makes me a living miracle.


Our love since has resulted in two baby girls, born when I was 39 and 41. On being an older parent, the world-renown parenting expert Dr. Vicki Panaccione eloquently sums up my own feelings :


It's possible to do this, but it's not likely. Look at the chart above. A lot of people would be misled by this statement.
But you got to ask yourself the question....what would astronaut Chris Hatfield do?
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Re: Do Not Marry Before Age 30

Postby channamasala » Thu Jun 20, 2013 21:29

HeadhonchoII wrote:
Our love since has resulted in two baby girls, born when I was 39 and 41. On being an older parent, the world-renown parenting expert Dr. Vicki Panaccione eloquently sums up my own feelings :


It's possible to do this, but it's not likely. Look at the chart above. A lot of people would be misled by this statement.



I agree it's a lot harder and somewhat riskier, but I know two more real-life cases in which it happened without much problem - my brother-in-law (born when Mom-in-Law was 40, my husband was born when she was 36) and my aunt (a kid at 37 and another at 41).

I know that's just anecdata, but still. It's not like it's as rare as a Bigfoot sighting or anything.
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Re: Do Not Marry Before Age 30

Postby channamasala » Thu Jun 20, 2013 21:34

HeadhonchoII wrote:
channamasala wrote:Not everyone wants children. And if you marry at around 30 and do want a child or two, it's not generally impossible. Sure, fertility decreases a bit around that age, but not enough to prevent pregnancy to any great degree (that doesn't start up until sometime between 35 and 40), and it's not like a switch goes off on your 30th birthday. Marrying before 30 JUST because you want kids (not for any other reason, like you've met the right person and you feel it's the right time) is total claptrap.

But really, the issue in Taiwan isn't fertility or age of marriage. Most couples in Taiwan who marry do have children - they're just having one or two kids instead of 3-6 - and those who don't generally don't because they want to remain child-free. You know what the real issues are with the birthrate (which, IMHO, is not as serious a problem as everyone says it is. Taiwan should be at replacement level and nothing more. The country's overcrowded with stretched resources as it is).

I don'tany think I need to list out why the birthrate is so low. But it's not directly related to women marrying after 30 (correlation does not equal causation) - although the two are spuriously related, and it's not because of "plasticizer".


Your maths isn't as good as your debating skills. The raised average of thirty includes a cohort of mid 30s and up who will find it disproportionately harder to have children. This is a real issue for many couples as evidenced by the large number of people who attend IVF clinics in Taiwan. Your spurious logic is at fault here.

Although IVF odds are improving most people do not have success.

As for not wanting children, fair enough, but if you want children it's important to consider the age factor. This of course happens in the west too as many women rush to find a partner with whom to have a child.


If you marry in your 30s and decide to have a kid around 35, it's perfectly likely you'll have one. It's more around late 30s to 40 that it starts to get a lot harder a lot faster. But that's not what I was talking about above.

Birth rates are low because people are having fewer kids once married (I know that sounds like a "duh" statement, but a lot of people assume it's because people are choosing not to have any kids, and that's not the case), but the reason seems to be a desire to have fewer kids, not age-imposed infertility. They'd likely have just as few kids - 1, maybe 2 - if they'd married earlier. The desire to have fewer kids has many causes that I really don't think I need to get into. That's what I mean when I say that the low birthrate isn't due to people marrying later. Fertility does decline. I'm not disputing that. I just don't think that's the main cause.

Although in some cases it is due to people who would have married in a traditional society who, in modern society where these things aren't quite so arranged anymore, never do. Not the same as "marrying later". Has more to do with social issues than fertility.

Either way, I don't think the birthrate even needs to go up that much. Replacement level only.
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Re: Do Not Marry Before Age 30

Postby Kal El » Thu Jun 20, 2013 23:14

channamasala wrote:Birth rates are low because people are having fewer kids once married (I know that sounds like a "duh" statement, but a lot of people assume it's because people are choosing not to have any kids, and that's not the case), but the reason seems to be a desire to have fewer kids, not age-imposed infertility. They'd likely have just as few kids - 1, maybe 2 - if they'd married earlier. The desire to have fewer kids has many causes that I really don't think I need to get into. That's what I mean when I say that the low birthrate isn't due to people marrying later. Fertility does decline. I'm not disputing that. I just don't think that's the main cause.

I don't often do, but I have to agree with you here. A decade or more ago it was very common to teach elementary aged kids with two or three siblings. Now, it's rare that they even have one, even in the case of only child girls.
Case in point - One class I have of 5th/6th graders in Da Qiao (Yong Kang district, Tainan, i.e. working class/Taike area) includes five girls and three boys. All are only children (aged 11/12). I asked them about their parents today. The one 12 year old girl said her dad is 33 and her mom is 32. So, they had her when dad was 20/21 and mom was 19/20. A very fertile age, probably knocked-up. Yet they still haven't bothered to have another kid, much less the "Holy Grail", i.e. a boy. All the other kids' parents are between 35-40.

I see this all over. And if this is the case in a working class area in the South (it's the same, or more so elsewhere in Tainan), then I can only imagine the situation is the same or "worse" in hoity-toity Taipei. :idunno:

So yeah, I call bullshit on the "Taiwanese aren't having kids because they're getting married later and have fertility issues" scenario. Some, perhaps. Many even, maybe. But it's not what's pulling the birthrate down. People are choosing to have less kids, or none at all.
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Re: Do Not Marry Before Age 30

Postby Icon » Fri Jun 21, 2013 10:17

Both could be right: people simply can't afford kids. So, they marry later (and hence end up with fertility issues) or simply choose to have fewer kids or none at all because they can't afford them or can't afford a nice lifestyle on today's salaries and a kid.

Yesterday, there was discussion on this problem on the news, as a single plot in Xinyi sold for like 3.58 million per ping, yet some people close to that area can't afford 3 meals a day...

Furthermore, values change. Some people still feel duty bound to carry on the family name. Some people marry for face/status. By 30, though, you should more or less have priorities figured out and a sort of estability to be reliable enough as to be part of someone's life. Some people just know what they want and are ready to make it happen.
"Lo urgente no deja tiempo para lo importante". Mafalda
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Re: Do Not Marry Before Age 30

Postby Kal El » Fri Jun 21, 2013 11:57

It's not just Taiwan: Looking for LTR

Some people just take forever, because they have really high/weird/unrealistic standards. :idunno:
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Re: Do Not Marry Before Age 30

Postby Elegua » Fri Jun 21, 2013 12:28

Kal El wrote:It's not just Taiwan: Looking for LTR

Some people just take forever, because they have really high/weird/unrealistic standards. :idunno:


That ad is both repellent and amusing at the same time.
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Re: Do Not Marry Before Age 30

Postby HeadhonchoII » Fri Jun 21, 2013 13:08

Hilarious ad, turns out its a gay guy and not a woman as I assumed.
But you got to ask yourself the question....what would astronaut Chris Hatfield do?
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Re: Do Not Marry Before Age 30

Postby Kal El » Fri Jun 21, 2013 13:09

HeadhonchoII wrote:Hilarious ad, turns out its a gay guy and not a woman as I assumed.

Double awesome, then!! :thumbsup:

Where did you see it's a gay dude?

Edit: Ok, I just saw the men seeking men part. :eek:
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Re: Do Not Marry Before Age 30

Postby John Ross » Fri Jun 21, 2013 13:20

It's a Mare Fecunditatis in the Savage Territories over which I govern. A plentitude of young families with two or three kids.
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Re: Do Not Marry Before Age 30

Postby Toad » Fri Jun 21, 2013 13:37

John Ross wrote:It's a Mare Fecunditatis in the Savage Territories over which I govern. A plentitude of young families with two or free kids.

Something to do with droit du seigneur, perhaps?

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Re: Do Not Marry Before Age 30

Postby Kal El » Fri Jun 21, 2013 13:41

John Ross wrote:It's a Mare Fecunditatis in the Savage Territories over which I govern. A plentitude of young families with two or free kids.

That's because they have nothing else to do in Jiayi. :grin:
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